Called to CARE: Scott Sabin (PlantWithPurpose.org)
Called to CARE with SCOTT SABIN, ceo, Plant With Purpose. Solving Poverty with environmental care. Learning from "the Poor." Redefining "Inclusion." Choosing to grow a future we can all look forward to. Leaving things better than you find them. Creating abundance by caring for the living members of the creation... That's what this podcast is about. Hope you enjoy Called to CARE with Scott Sabin.
"Right now we are directly serving about 500,000 people and having a measurable impact on just over 1,000,000 people." - SCOTT
CARE: Curious. Appropriate. Responsive. Empathetic.
In this interview world-changing Christian leader, Scott Sabin, whose organization is currently helping more than 1,000,000 people in nine countries, shares some insights after 30 years of leading breakthrough sustainable development work. Scott is joined by legendary funk bassist, noted author, and care-centric pastor, Reverend Jimi Calhoun, as well as the co-founder/executive editor of AllCreation.org, Chris Searles.
Plant With Purpose is a nonprofit organization utilizing globally-strategic reforestation, regenerative agriculture, purpose groups, community-savings groups, church partners, and open-hearted, Christian-community values to lift roughly one million of the world's most isolated and under-resourced people out of poverty today. When Scott started with the organization as executive director, 30 years ago, they had one program and just 80 participants.
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COHOSTS
Rev. Jimi Calhoun is lead pastor at BridgingAustin.org, an influential musician and a noted author (JimiCalhoun.com) who's just published his fifth book. Chris Searles is founder/director at BioIntegrity Partnerships (biointegrity.net), an environmental solutions nonprofit which produces AllCreation.org, and co-founder/executive editor at AllCreation.org.
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39:25 “POVERTY”
46:40 THE FUTURE WE CHOOSE
0:45 Intro' Rev. Jimi Calhoun, co-host
2:15 Intro' Scott Sabin, special guest
5:45 Scott on PlantWithPurpose: “We stand on the shoulders of giants... Literally, everything we’re doing now, we learned from our local partners... It's so easy to approach things as if we have all the answers... They're planting the trees, not us, almost 62 million trees now... Managing over $12 million of their own money... making about an 18 to 20% return on their investments...
INCLUSION
13:10 Jimi, story on Landi the landscaper and being a Christian missionary in Belize (Central America). "The first thing I learned (as a missionary) was to value people as you find them... When you're inserted into a different culture you have two choices, try and convert them to what you're bringing, or allow yourself to be stretched a little bit... Sensitivity and humility, those are our bywords."
20:30 Scott, on the prejudices against subsistence farmers, “The people we work with are our Partners not our projects... We have as much to learn from them -- or more, than we have to offer and it’s in working together that anything’s accomplished.”
22:25 Jimi, story on Castillo the part-maker, "Ingenuity doesn't come from regurgitating what came in, it comes from your observation and what you're able to do with what you see!"
24:50 Scott, "Most of us couldn't survive in these environments, so people we might look at as uneducated, or who might be discriminated against by their own governments, are incredibly resourceful and managing to survive in conditions that would kill us. They've got a lot to teach us."
26:00 Jimi, "I have a responsibility to love you as you are, to serve you when I can, and to love you whatever it is that you need. That's what I mean, and Bridging means, when we say the word, Christian."
27:20 Scott, "I've become convinced that part of our purpose is to serve others..." Scott talks about one of his first visits to the Congo and the freedom fighter turned peace-maker, “I realized I had gifts to offer...”
REDEEMING "WORK"
30:30 Chris, "We should take pride in our potential..."
31:30 Jimi, “In work and worship you find God." ... "You have to define work... I never think of any call I make or any conversation I have as work... It’s all geared towards improving the life of someone else in whatever way they need it..."
33:50 Scott, "I don't want to romanticize things… There’s a lot of places and a lot of people where work is drudgery or slavery, or serves no purpose, or is abusive, so I don’t want to romanticize that. But I do think that, at its best, in the Kingdom of God there’s an alignment between purpose and what we do, and that we were made to be co-creators… But again, I don't want to romanticize: being a subsistence farmer on a barren hillside somewhere in East Africa is HARD."
35:25 Jimi stories on the banana lady; Indentured-Irish "slaves" and African slaves
38:30 Scott, "Some of Plant With Purpose's work is to bring good news of Redemption and offer opportunities to redeem work."
"POVERTY"
39:40 Chris, "How do you define Poverty and relate it to caring for "the least of these"?"
40:00 Scott - “Poverty: “A state of hopelessness.” Western definitions tend to be a lot about a lack of material things. Those of the global south, talking about poverty, it tends to be much more: hopelessness, discouragement, embarrassment… My definition, a lack of agency or perceived agency and opportunity, which can be closely connected to hopelessness. If you’re hopeless you don’t exercise what agency you might have.”
41:25 Jimi - “What does poverty mean to you when you hear that word? … Poverty has more components to it than economics. . .” … It took men a long time to realize that they were acting exactly as they should. You know, I thought I could come down and offer some pointers… And that’s NOT what they needed. They needed somebody to come along and say, I understand your attitude. I get why you see the world the way you do... there’s not a lot of good options on your horizon, you don’t see a way out of this.”
44:40 Scott: "Your comment about those who are economically wealthy, but spiritually-impoverished is important... We come in many ways impoverished as well.”
FUTURE WE CHOOSE
5:45 Scott on PlantWithPurpose: “We stand on the shoulders of giants... Literally, everything we’re doing now, we learned from our local partners... It's so easy to approach things as if we have all the answers... They're planting the trees, not us, almost 62 million trees now... Managing over $12 million of their own money... making about an 18 to 20% return on their investments...
INCLUSION
13:10 Jimi, story on Landi the landscaper and being a Christian missionary in Belize (Central America). "The first thing I learned (as a missionary) was to value people as you find them... When you're inserted into a different culture you have two choices, try and convert them to what you're bringing, or allow yourself to be stretched a little bit... Sensitivity and humility, those are our bywords."
20:30 Scott, on the prejudices against subsistence farmers, “The people we work with are our Partners not our projects... We have as much to learn from them -- or more, than we have to offer and it’s in working together that anything’s accomplished.”
22:25 Jimi, story on Castillo the part-maker, "Ingenuity doesn't come from regurgitating what came in, it comes from your observation and what you're able to do with what you see!"
24:50 Scott, "Most of us couldn't survive in these environments, so people we might look at as uneducated, or who might be discriminated against by their own governments, are incredibly resourceful and managing to survive in conditions that would kill us. They've got a lot to teach us."
26:00 Jimi, "I have a responsibility to love you as you are, to serve you when I can, and to love you whatever it is that you need. That's what I mean, and Bridging means, when we say the word, Christian."
27:20 Scott, "I've become convinced that part of our purpose is to serve others..." Scott talks about one of his first visits to the Congo and the freedom fighter turned peace-maker, “I realized I had gifts to offer...”
REDEEMING "WORK"
30:30 Chris, "We should take pride in our potential..."
31:30 Jimi, “In work and worship you find God." ... "You have to define work... I never think of any call I make or any conversation I have as work... It’s all geared towards improving the life of someone else in whatever way they need it..."
33:50 Scott, "I don't want to romanticize things… There’s a lot of places and a lot of people where work is drudgery or slavery, or serves no purpose, or is abusive, so I don’t want to romanticize that. But I do think that, at its best, in the Kingdom of God there’s an alignment between purpose and what we do, and that we were made to be co-creators… But again, I don't want to romanticize: being a subsistence farmer on a barren hillside somewhere in East Africa is HARD."
35:25 Jimi stories on the banana lady; Indentured-Irish "slaves" and African slaves
38:30 Scott, "Some of Plant With Purpose's work is to bring good news of Redemption and offer opportunities to redeem work."
"POVERTY"
39:40 Chris, "How do you define Poverty and relate it to caring for "the least of these"?"
40:00 Scott - “Poverty: “A state of hopelessness.” Western definitions tend to be a lot about a lack of material things. Those of the global south, talking about poverty, it tends to be much more: hopelessness, discouragement, embarrassment… My definition, a lack of agency or perceived agency and opportunity, which can be closely connected to hopelessness. If you’re hopeless you don’t exercise what agency you might have.”
41:25 Jimi - “What does poverty mean to you when you hear that word? … Poverty has more components to it than economics. . .” … It took men a long time to realize that they were acting exactly as they should. You know, I thought I could come down and offer some pointers… And that’s NOT what they needed. They needed somebody to come along and say, I understand your attitude. I get why you see the world the way you do... there’s not a lot of good options on your horizon, you don’t see a way out of this.”
44:40 Scott: "Your comment about those who are economically wealthy, but spiritually-impoverished is important... We come in many ways impoverished as well.”
FUTURE WE CHOOSE
46:20 Chris, "Biospherically, the system is designed to renew; we’re just sitting on top of potential all the time."
48:20 Scott, “First we saw a vicious cycle between environmental degradation and the impoverishment of their farms… We had a vicious cycle, what I learned from them is there is a possibility in that of creating a virtuous cycle, and actually a win-win… We often look at human need and environmental issues as a zero sum game... and I think there’s tremendous potential if we: 1) seek out the win win, 2) approach everything from a spirit of abundance rather than scarcity, 3) partner with those we serve... “Probably the greatest untapped resource in the world (is subsistence farmers), they have so much to offer, so much creativity, and THEY’RE THE ONES who planted 61 million trees, not us! ... Like I say, they're our partners not our projects.”
51:10 Chris, How to utilize and implement PlantWithPurpose's ideas locally?
52:06 Scott, "Looking for the win-win... We're intended to be good news for Creation... What does that look like in practice? We're supposed to be good news to All of Creation. Are we in our communities of Faith life-giving or death-dealing? ... We can be a living witness to the Kingdom of God, bringing good news to ALL of God’s creation."
53:30, Scott, "To your earlier question about Global Poverty... You can see the impacts. I’ve seen poverty dramatically reduced at the same time I’ve seen forests return, rivers begin to flow again, and fruitfulness return to the land, and I think that is scalable... Right now we are directly serving about 500,000 people and having a measurable impact on just over 1,000,000 people."
55:00, Scott "And forests and fertile soil sequester carbon and have an impact on climate change. I’ve seen local farmers get excited about the fact that they're having a positive impact on the climate... and they get excited not just that “we’re doing something for our community," but "I’m doing something for the planet.”
56:25, Jimi, "Perception precedes perspective..."
52:06 Scott, "Looking for the win-win... We're intended to be good news for Creation... What does that look like in practice? We're supposed to be good news to All of Creation. Are we in our communities of Faith life-giving or death-dealing? ... We can be a living witness to the Kingdom of God, bringing good news to ALL of God’s creation."
53:30, Scott, "To your earlier question about Global Poverty... You can see the impacts. I’ve seen poverty dramatically reduced at the same time I’ve seen forests return, rivers begin to flow again, and fruitfulness return to the land, and I think that is scalable... Right now we are directly serving about 500,000 people and having a measurable impact on just over 1,000,000 people."
55:00, Scott "And forests and fertile soil sequester carbon and have an impact on climate change. I’ve seen local farmers get excited about the fact that they're having a positive impact on the climate... and they get excited not just that “we’re doing something for our community," but "I’m doing something for the planet.”
56:25, Jimi, "Perception precedes perspective..."
58:05 Chris, "The inspiration that I get from each for you is profound... It's exciting... Look what Scott did in 30 years, where could we be in 30 more years?!”
WHAT IS A #1 PRIORITY?
WHAT IS A #1 PRIORITY?
1:00:10 Chris, What is the one thing you wished everyone was acting on?
1:00:50 Scott, “You don’t have to see this work as a zero sum game... I see good news every single day... (Thirty years ago) I remember thinking "This is futile. What are we doin' this for?" And, this Spring I walked through a forest with trees that were 40 feet high, the smell of pine needles, the birds perching in the branches, the farmer talking about the biodiversity that had returned, the stream that was flowing and the deer that had come back… If we see it as hopeless, we lose our agency. It’s not hopeless!"
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REFERENCES
- Scott: Brian McClaren, Tony Campollo, Rev. Sibomana (in the Congo)
- Jimi: Brian McClaren, Belize, The Iona Community
- Jimi's work: BridgingAustin.org (Jimi's church), JimiCalhoun.com, Jimi's books
- Chris's work: AllCreation.org, BioIntegrity
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Thanks for listening.
Produced, recorded and edited by Chris Searles.
Produced, recorded and edited by Chris Searles.
Presented by AllCreation.org and BioIntegrity.net.
Visit AllCreation.org/Care for more content.
Visit the AllCreation podcast for more audio!
Visit AllCreation.org/Care for more content.
Visit the AllCreation podcast for more audio!